Talk:Porter Rockwell

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More info[edit]

I found this information on this site, but I don't know how to elegantly work it into the article:

  • Married Feb 2, 1832 Luana Beebee
  • Baptized April 6, 1830
  • July 6, 1838 ordained deacon
  • 1846 ordained elder

It also says he died on June 8th instead of the 9th (which is it?). I was kinda under the impression that Rockwell was a bachelor—did she die or did he divorce her? Anyway, does someone else want to take a crack at adding this info?

Also, I heard that some members were critical of Rockwell because he occasionally (probably secretly) drank. That info should be added as well, IMHO. — Frecklefoot | Talk 20:57, Apr 20, 2005 (UTC)

But not for being a murderer? Taco Deposit | Talk-o to Taco 22:36, Apr 20, 2005 (UTC)
The word of wisdom was applied differently then than it is now in a number of ways.Isaac Crumm 11:48, 28 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Well, like the article says, he "never killed anyone who didn't need killing." ;-) — Frecklefoot | Talk 13:49, Apr 21, 2005 (UTC)

Porter is a relative of mine and I have had many years to study him. I will say this; The facts about him that are the strongest, are his love of people.. good people. Drinking is what killed him, not bullets or blades, and he lost control of that vice after he cut his hair off for the widow. Drinking was common among many saints during the earlier years because the word of wisdom was a suggestion rather than a commitment for temple worthy cleanliness. Luanna had her title as his wife stamped on her grave, however, but they were divorced as far as I have been able to find. One thing is for sure, He loved the prophet Joseph Smith with all his heart. Ahaidedej.

It is very difficult to distinguish fact from fiction regarding Porter Rockwell.Isaac Crumm 11:48, 28 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Concerning "fact from fiction" ... What exactly was OPR's role in the Bear River Massacre? (since it was that article which led me here). Was his role passive (just a scout), or did he play a more active part in the events of that fateful day? Kevin8 14:38, 30 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I do have one good link for you Kevin, and something about Porter. (I sensed you wanted to know if he helped kill Women and Children)

http://www.historynet.com/wars_conflicts/american_indian_wars/3027481.html?showAll=y&c=y

One must take into account war time psychology and the pressures everyone was under during those times. It was a different mental era than we have now. Connor was fighting a Cold war with Brigham Young and being very secretive about his ambitions to “quell” the so called Shoshoni uprising to further his political ambitions. The LDS people were all on the verge of war with the Native Americans and Cash Valley residents were wanting help with renegades. That’s why many welcomed the soldiers. The last thing Brigham wanted was to deal with worsening Indian struggles while the rest of the country were using magistrates and military personnel to disrupt LDS lifestyles in Deseret. The Union Army itself was the ultimate authority where ever it traveled. Since the Church had a policy of feed the Indians rather than fight, they had to be careful when securing settlements and finding the right perpetrators to bring to justice. I believe those sent with Connor Such as Porter Rockwell were there primarily as eyes and ears for the Church. I personally don’t see Porter being engaged in the massacre because Connor himself, a Mormon hater, would have loved to implicate Port and Brigham together in the misdeed as soon as he received flack for the Incident back east, but his initial reports merely mention Porter guided him to the Bear River Valleys. He gloated in the ability to become Brigadier General over the event initially, but never could wrestle the political grip from the Saints hands in Utah. The reason I believe this is 1- Now Brigham knew who Connor the man really was, a weasel, - not to be trusted. 2- Porter went to Brigham City to procure transportation for the dead and injured soldiers, and families to quarter them. 3- Men like William Head were sent to help the Remaining Indians who were left alive. 4- Everyone loves to hate the LDS people yet never backs away from the societies hand outs and charities, ( Even 10 years later the Shoshoni’s them selves converted and learned to farm. They would not have done this if they felt the Church helped attack them.) 5- If I was a saint living then, I would probably like to see Connor fail at the task, document it accurately, See my militia secure my own people and get corrupt officials out of office, and a war mongering Army out of the territory. Finally If Rockwell did witness this atrocity I am sure he would want to drink it out of his memory as much as he could because he loved women and children and always defended them, and what ever report he brought back to his friends about the terrible incident would never be dwelt upon again if he could help it. Porter Rockwell was a man of Honor and would not have participated in an attack like this. In my Opinion. Jedediah.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.113.19.8 (talk • contribs) 11:19, 23 December 2006‎

mostly opinion[edit]

why is so much opinion, not facts, allowed on this page? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.38.155.134 (talk) 03:08, 27 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]


Luana Beebe[edit]

Unless we can find more info on Porter's wife, which is doubtful, I think her article should be merged into this one. Caerwine Caerwhine 01:03, 4 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Great info in The History of Draper, Utah[edit]

There's a ton of information on Porter Rockwell in the History of Draper, Utah with some talk of his wife as well. It even contains a drawing of the way station Rockwell ran in the southern part of the Salt Lake Valley.

"Orrin Porter Rockwell had a saloon and way station near the Crystal Hot Lakes, just south of where the Utah State Prison now stands. The saloon furnished not only alcohol but food and a rest stop for stagecoaches and the pony express riders." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.27.113.92 (talk) 19:29, 12 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Porter Rockwell's daughter Mary A. Reid?[edit]

I'm confused. This is his daughter? But she had a different last name?

http://content.lib.utah.edu/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/USHS_Class&CISOPTR=3000&CISOBOX=1&REC=1

She was married 3 time and moved out to california —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.138.60.84 (talk) 02:04, 31 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Removed Butch Cassidy/Jesse James Reference[edit]

There's a bit of an issue with comparing Rockwell to Cassidy when Cassidy served time in Prison, was a notorious robber and to Jesse James who was a murderer.

Those claims with Rockwell are speculative. He was never convicted (in fact he was implicated) in the accused murders. James on the other hand killed numerous people. Hardly a fair comparison. Cassidy was a train and bank robber. Rockwell neither resembles or was convicted of any sort of behavior even remotely similar to what these two were famous for. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.103.249.13 (talk) 23:06, 14 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Pale Rider[edit]

The source given for the idea that Rockwell was an inspiration for the pale rider is a hat shop. Really, shouldn't we be doing better than that? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.218.46.85 (talk) 06:06, 8 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Baptism date[edit]

An anon user made this change, which altered his baptism date from June to April. It may have been an act of vandalism, or a helpful edit, but I can't tell which because I can't find any information on his actual baptism date. Can someone verify or refute this change? A ref for the date would also be helpful. Thanks! — Frecklefσσt | Talk 16:46, 9 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

 Done — It is correct as April 6, 1830, neighbors to the Joseph and Emma Smith family. Interesting reading in the reference added. — Charles Edwin Shipp (talk) 22:28, 27 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Another photo[edit]

Another good photo of Rockwell is on page 61 of Frank Esshom's 1913 edition of Pioneers and Prominent Men of Utah. -- 208.81.184.4 (talk) 16:11, 9 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Boggs section[edit]

It would be a good idea to remove the last excerpt from the Boggs assassination section, seeing as how it is poorly cited and a subject change that is not backed up with more information. (Gilligansisland94 (talk))

The Truth Should Be Told[edit]

Joshua, in the old Testament, had God stop the sun so he could kill and carve out a place for Christianity. In Joshua 10

13 King James Bible

And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day.

The truth is that Porter Rockwell did kill bad men and evil men and if he hadn't, Mormonism might not be here. He was the Joshua of the Church and ignoring these facts or seeing him as evil is misunderstanding what some men of God are called to do and does his memory a real disservice.

He protected what he thought was God's church the same way Joshua and Moses did. Watering down the truth is sickening to me.

In the chaos that ensued after the death of Smith, the Mormons often engaged in battles with mobs of non-Mormons. On September 16, 1845 Rockwell was hastily deputized by the Sheriff of Hancock County Illinois, Jacob Blackenstos. Blackenstos was a non-Mormon but was friendly to the Mormons. He was being chased by an anti-Mormon mob led by Frank Worrell, who had been in charge of the militia unit that failed to protect Joseph Smith when he was murdered. Rockwell took out his rifle and stopped the mob by shooting to death Worrell. Worrell thus became the first man killed by Rockwell, a total that would grow to 40-100, no one is certain, by the end of Rockwell’s life. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 170.72.55.159 (talk) 00:58, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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