Talk:Shimano

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Neutral point of view[edit]

This addition sounds intriguing, but it's not of a Neutral point of view. Please see the NPOV tutorial for pointers on moving it toward NPOV. --Christopherlin 21:59, 30 Mar 2005 (UTC)

"Shimano is innovative. Often these innovations result in propietary technologies. Shimano seems unwilling to delay the introduction of an innovation to build consensus for an industry standard and instead introduced the innovation as part of yearly incremental improvements. This almost guarentees that at the time of release no part from another manufacturer can be substituted for a Shimano part in the gruppo. Since innovations are introduced ever year as part of a gruppo, this cycle is endless. From an engineering perspective, Shimano creates optimized systems at the grouppo level. The parts of the system are optimized for use in the system and are often difficult to maintain, repair, or replace with other components. For example, maintining some Shimano parts require propietary Shimano tools."

As somebody of some experience in cycling (being that I'm a profesional cyclist) I'd say the point of that section is rather accurate. For instance dura ace (the top level groupo and hence the first to get new developements) are frequently incompatibily with any other dura ace group set other than of course that year's model. Although admittedly this section does have a very slight bias towards shimano, but that is no surprise because it is an article about shimano. So I'd say that very small amount it ok, just like the article on Romans would be very slightly biased towards them. Mathmo 06:32, 22 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Hmmm... on re-reading this, I see no overall bias in that section. And I'd be of mind to insert it back in, however I'll leave others a chance to say something first about this. Although if you are being very picky you could see bias in small sections overall it is of a satisfactory fair, balanced, and neutral level of writing. That it isn't to say it is perfect, nothing here is. But it is an excellent start that is worthy of being here for others to build upon. Mathmo06:36, 22 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Biopace[edit]

I've removed Biopace as a "Shimano innovation". I'm afraid it wasn't. It is as old as the 19th century and has been abandoned as often as it has been reintroduced. Les woodland (talk) 13:12, 27 March 2008 (UTC)les woodland[reply]

I've put it back in. Elliptical/oval chain rings had been tried before, [Biopace] were not conventional ellipticals, they were essentially the opposite, hence an innovation. Well, they were at least enough of an innovation to be patentable. The Sheldon Brown page linked from the Biopace article describes this well. --Philbarker (talk) 10:14, 28 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Shimano innovations[edit]

Is the Nexus automatic shifting really "computerized"? The product literature refers to a CPU, but I'm not sure if that is marketing speak or if there is really a computer chip in there. Maybe a better description is "electronic", again, if it really is electronic. RosinDebow 03:18, 9 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Too many of the items in the section 'Shimano Innovations' are not innovations by Shimano. Non-round chainrings, low-axle pedals (Dyna Drive), hollow cranks, freehubs and 7-spd internal gears were all improved, revived or promoted by Shimano, but none of them are Shimano innovations. I suspect outboard bottom-bracket bearings were done before Shimano also, but I don't have the references to verify this. I will reword the section heading when I can think of an apposite term to use. Centrepull (talk) 12:41, 9 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I think this section should be called 'Shimano products' or 'Notable Shimano products' (but then who decides what is notable?), as none of them are innovations. Gear hubs are an invention of Sturmey-Archer, gear hubs with a wide range and in an oil bath are an innovation of Rohloff. Alternatively the title can stay but then every entry should have a source, as none of them have a source now all should be removed until somebody comes up with sources.
I wait a few days, if there are no replies I'll change the title of the section.Nico (talk) 12:16, 7 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
The change you suggest, 'Shimano products', sounds like a move in the right direction. -AndrewDressel (talk) 12:28, 7 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Groupsets[edit]

Are each of the lists of groupsets in descending order of quality. It seams that way but it does not specify, and I am not familiar with all of them. If someone knows can you state that they are either in order or ‘in no particular order’. Thanks, --Broecher (talk) 03:05, 8 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I was an early user of Shimano Dura-Ace in the early 1970's. I put Dura-Ace front and rear derailleurs and Dura-Ace brakes on a Follis frame and they worked as well or better than the currently popular Campy Record stuff. The stuff was great and a lot less expensive than Campy. This article seems to think that Dura-Ace was introduced in the 1980's which is not true. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.250.86.156 (talk) 04:55, 11 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Unbalanced[edit]

Shimano is indeed a revered name in cycling equipment, but it is an equally revered name in fishing - it's spinning reels in particular are considered the standard of the industry by many. This article needs an expansion to include more than it's current mere mention of it's involvement in the field of fishing equipment. 69.54.207.13 (talk) 04:22, 10 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I totally agree. Shimano reels are really excellent and widely used by fishermen all around the globe. Their fishing rodes are not bad too. And more so, their fishing program has been on the market for at least two decades (I don't know how long exactly). Based on this article, it seems as if they've just started producing fishing equipment as a new enterprise.

Undisclosed Revenue for Public Corporation[edit]

How can the revenue for a public corporation be undisclosed? I though by law that type of information has to be disclosed? Allyn (talk) 03:45, 2 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Look here. Not sure how to incorporate this info: http://www.shimano.com/publish/content/global_corp/en/us/index/financial_information/financial_results.download.-mainParsys-0002-downloadFile.html/Summary%20of%20Financial%20Results%20FY2009-1H.pdf Mollynet (talk) 22:35, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Negative bias and untrue[edit]

The following section is actually flatly against what happened. Shimano introduced innovations at their high end group and trickled them down to the lower groups. Also, they might be a bit cheaper than Campagnolo, they certainly didn't wage a price war n the smaller german/french companies. They simply out-innovated them. Also, the components were actually of higher quality than the French/German equivalents.

"During this period, in contrast to the near-universal marketing technique of introducing innovations on the expensive side of the marketplace and relying on consumer demand to emulate early adopters along with economy of scale to bring them into the mass market, Shimano and SunTour (to a lesser extent) introduced new technologies at the lowest end of the bicycle market, using lower cost and often heavier and less durable materials and techniques, only moving them further upmarket if they established themselves in the lower market segments." — Preceding unsigned comment added by Fietser (talk • contribs) 07:45, 20 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Sheldon seems to agree that Shimano used to innovate on the low end, but after Positron in the early 1980s, Shimano switched to their current trickle down method. See his description here and here. -AndrewDressel (talk) 01:55, 12 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Shimano STEPS[edit]

What has happend to Shimano STEPS? Why is there no mention of it? (see http://www.bikeradar.com/news/article/shimano-unveil-new-steps-electric-bike-components-26649/) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 176.6.187.188 (talk) 21:09, 11 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

If you feel it is worthy of inclusion, by all means, go ahead and include it. -AndrewDressel (talk) 01:56, 12 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Sora 4600 gruppo[edit]

There are no Sora 4600 products on the Shimano website as of August 2013. Therefore, I am removing from the table the mention that they were introduced in 2011. If I am wrong, please document this. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Coemgenv (talk • contribs) 03:28, 27 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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Updated total revenue is now available from Wikidata[edit]

can someone fix so that it is pulled into the infobox?--So9q (talk) 08:46, 24 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Shimano vs. SRAM market share in road cycling[edit]

Hi, I analyzed 647 mass produced road bikes from dozens of brands offered in 2023. I found that Shimano components were on 70% of them (SRAM 26.3%, Campagnolo 3.4%, others 0.3%). Maybe it would be nice to add this specific information directly to the article alongside the estimated market share? The info is available here in the Groupset Stats: Shimano and SRAM vs. Everybody Else section: https://www.cyclistshub.com/road-bike-prices-and-weights-statistics/ Minarik Petr (talk) 10:48, 28 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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