Talk:Château de Chenonceau

Old posts

Everything else matches up, but this paragraph:

In 1864, Daniel Wilson, a Scotsman who had made a fortune installing gaslights throughout Paris, bought the chateau for his daughter. In the tradition of Catherine de Medici, she would spend a fortune on elaborate parties to such an extent that her finances were depleted and the chateau was seized and sold to an American.

directly contradicts this section on the official Chenonceau website:

1864

Marguerite Pelouze took possession of Chenonceau, which had been sold to her husband, the famous chemist, Théophile Pelouze, by Madame Dupin’s heirs. The fortunes of the castle were once again in the hands of an energetic and dedicated woman.

1867

After the death of her husband, Madame Pelouze proceeded with some very important construction work until 1878. She entrusted the architect Roguet with the task of giving the castle the appearance which it presumedly had at the beginning of the XVIth century. Many of the alterations carried out by Catherine de Medici were thus destroyed. The caryatids on the façade of the castle were removed and relocated to the park.

What's the origin of the Daniel Wilson story? Is there other evidence one way or the other who owned it between Dupin and Menier?

Thanks~ --Catherine | talk 07:09, 27 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Hello Catherine! Obviously it's been awhile since you left this note, but I think I have an answer to your question. These two sources may not actually contradict each other. Marguerite Pelouze was the daughter of Daniel Wilson, the gaslight man, who was quite rich. (Her brother, also named Daniel Wilson, later became the son-in-law of Jules Grévy and involved in a political scandal.) The château was officially purchased by Marguerite's husband, [Update: actually the son of] Théophile-Jules Pelouze, but her father likely supplied most of the money necessary for the purchase. Pelouze definitely owned the château, he and his wife both lived there, and after his death she had Roguet make the alterations that removed several of the changes made by Catherine de' Medici. --Robert.Allen (talk) 06:37, 14 June 2014 (UTC)

The French article did not supply a reference, but I found a good one at Google Books (hopefully you can read this partial preview). --Robert.Allen (talk) 07:11, 14 June 2014 (UTC)

According to the French article her father died in 1843, so she was already a rich heiress. and her father-in-law died in 1867, not her husband. Her marriage to the son was dissolved in 1869. Anyway, it looks like both sources have some errors. --Robert.Allen (talk) 08:15, 14 June 2014 (UTC)

confusing statement

"during the Second War it was a means of escaping from the Nazi occupied Vichy zone on one side of the River Cher to the free zone on the opposite bank."

This confuses me. Both parts of France were "occupied" in one sense by the Germans in WW2, though I thought troops were really only stationed in the northern and Atlantic seaboards. If someone were crossing from Vichy to occupied France, wouldn't they be going into a less free zone?

Recent addition

Anon user,

Thanks for the contribution to Château de Chenonceau, and the hard work you have put into formatting and linking it; however, the information appears to be copied from http://www.marie-stuart.co.uk/France/Chenonceau.htm . If you are the original author and copyright-holder of this material, and are willing to license it under the GNU Free Documentation License (see Wikipedia:Copyrights for details), then we can use it. Otherwise, I'm afraid it will have to be deleted, as we can not use material that is copyrighted by others in our free encyclopedia. Please respond so we can clear this up. Thank you! — Catherine\^talk 17:19, 9 November 2005 (UTC)

From 82.229.179.20( anon user) To Catherine

Before you delete anything, could you please wait a little while for me to clear the copyright situation as quickly as possible. Thank you

edit : Copyright issue has been solved since the text added here comes directly from the visit guide that anybody can buy at the castle . the work that has been done here is under direct supervision from the owners and managers of chenonceau. if you have any question please feel free to email at : info@chenonceau.com

Coordinate error

The coordinates need the following fixes:

• Write here

47.3250° N 1.0706° E 24.127.198.110 (talk) 07:45, 27 November 2009 (UTC)

Um, those are the coordinates currently in the article (and appear to have been the same when you posted this). They are correct as they stand. Deor (talk) 21:08, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Image Error

The image labeled as "The Gallery" is not a picture from the actual Gallery of the Château de Chenonceau. An actual representation of the gallery's current state can be seen on the Château's official website.

--Keith Goodwin (talk) 17:59, 14 December 2009 (UTC)

The picture is correct. It's the same gallery, not the same floor:

• 
  Ground floor
• 
  Second floor

— M-le-mot-dit (T) 18:51, 14 December 2009 (UTC)

Dating of inscriptions

There is a bit of information that confuses me.

A part of the section of the Chapelle it says: 'Inscriptions were left upon the walls of the chapel by Mary, Queen of Scots' Scottish guards: on the right, "Man's anger does not accomplish God's Justice" (dated 1543) and "Do not let yourself be won over by Evil" (dated 1546).'

The two dates 1543 and 1546 are confirmed even in the French version of Château de Chenonceau, and also the small written guide given to tourists in the castle contains the same dates.

But according to the article about Mary, Queen of Scots the events detailed there are in some contradiction with these 2 dates.

- Mary was born on 8 December 1542, thus, in 1543 she could not be more than 1 year old. It sounds strange that in the middle ages even a queen starts a long journey with a so young kid if not absolute necessity.

- According to the text 'When French ships were spotted on the Scottish coast in July, it was felt they were a threat to Mary, and she moved with her mother to Stirling Castle which was considered safer. On 9 September 1543 Mary was crowned Queen of Scots in the chapel at this castle.' It also appears to be in contradiction with 1543. It does not look like her mother, Mary of Guise wanted to bring her to France.

- Based on this part 'With her marriage agreement in place, five-year-old Mary was sent to France to spend the next thirteen years at the French court, mainly at Amboise, near Tours.' it seems that Mary did not leave Scotland until 1547. So it questions the other date of 1546.

- Is it possible that Mary's Scottish guards were in Chenonceau without Mary? It is from a logical point of view, but it sounds weird.

I don't know how this mystery could be solved...or have I got something wrong ?

Balage75 (talk) 23:41, 28 September 2010 (UTC)

Brochure

I had the pleasure of visiting Chenonceau today. The entire "Inside the Chateau" section of this article is reprinted verbatim from the pamphlet that is given to visitors at the entrance. Just a heads up. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.97.218.117 (talk) 19:20, 12 May 2013 (UTC)

The text certainly does read rather like a brochure's. Hchc2009 (talk) 10:27, 18 May 2013 (UTC)

93.5.215.74 (talk · contribs) also raised the issue. Unfortunately it seems to date back seven and a half years, but the person who added the text does seem to have at least provided an email address in case there are questions (info@chenonceau.com). I've sent an email to the address and am awaiting a reply. As it's the weekend I don't expect a response until Monday at the earliest. The discussion from 93.5.215.74's talk page is copied below for reference. Nev1 (talk) 12:21, 18 May 2013 (UTC)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

Hi, I noticed the summary of your edit. Do you have more information on that brochure? Nev1 (talk) 20:13, 17 May 2013 (UTC)

I have a hard copy of it but I just checked the chateau's website and they don't have the same text on there. The chateau is privately owned so the brochure is very dense and informative but its text obviously has no place on the wiki for the building.

In that case there are two possibilities: either the Wikipedia article is copied from the brochure, or it's possible the brochure may be a print off of the Wikipedia article. The latter isn't unheard of, and if it's the former situation it is likely a copyright violation. Does the brochure have a date of publication? Nev1 (talk) 20:31, 17 May 2013 (UTC)

Says here on the brochure that is was produced by Apyrenne Communication. The photos are copyrighted from 2011. It is highly unlikely that the text is taken from the wiki as each room on this page is ordered in the exact order of the walking tour.

The text was added in late 2005, so has been here for a long time. The person who added the material said on the article's talk page "Copyright issue has been solved since the text added here comes directly from the visit guide that anybody can buy at the castle . the work that has been done here is under direct supervision from the owners and managers of chenonceau". They also gave an email address if there were any questions, to which I'll send a message. If this was done with permission of the owners, this needs to be made official, and if they know nothing about it we’ll have to effectively reduce the article to its 2005 state. Thank you for drawing attention to this, I'll aim to get it resolved. Nev1 (talk) 22:19, 17 May 2013 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Unfortunately, I've not had a reply so I think we should play it safe and assume we have a copyright violation on our hands. At the moment I haven't deleted the page history because policy states "Blatant copyright violations that can be redacted without removing attribution to non-infringing contributors. If redacting a revision would remove any contributor's attribution, this criterion cannot be used." For the most part the text, has changed very little since 2005, but there have been more than 500 edits since then so it may be prudent to leave it in place. Nev1 (talk) 19:04, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

NB: Will have a look tomorrow morning and see what I can find in the literature. Hchc2009 (talk) 19:25, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

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