User talk:Menchi/Stardate 0.0002

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• See User talk:Menchi for present Talk.

1. User talk:Menchi/Stardate 0.0001 (December 16, 2002 - June 18, 2003)
2. ...
3. "User talk:Menchi/Stardate 9.9999": Oops, running of out #, Starfleet must self-destruct. Guess we brainiacal superhumans should've learned that Insectoid Incident in the end of the the second millennium.

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Ant's artwork

Bonsoir Menchi. Merci de ton commentaire. It really moved me. I am glad you are appreciating them :-) User:anthere (your talk page is 10 kb over what my browser can assume)

Cleaned it up, now that I know the myth of page oversizing and posing as nuisance is real. --Menchi 00:50 20 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Bonjour. :-) Ce n'est pas un mythe :-) C'est une réalité, mais nous ne devons pas être très nombreux à en être victimes. Je dois très fréquemment éditer les pages d'utilisateur plutot que les pages de discussions, en particulier Brion et Mav. Quand à la pompe, il est rare que je puisse y accéder.

I put two additional little buggies pict yesterday (I need to change the caption, these are damselflies not dragonflies). See User:Anthere/PictInsectes. A +

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Adminship

Congratulations, you have just been made a sysop! You have volunteered for boring housekeeping activities which normal users sadly cannot participate in. Sysops basically can't do anything: They cannot delete pages arbitarily (only obvious junk like "jklasdfl,öasdf JOSH IS GAY"), they cannot protect pages in an edit war they are involved in, they cannot ban signed in users. What they can do is delete junk as it appears, ban anonymous vandals, remove pages that have been listed on Votes for deletion for more than a week, protect pages when asked to, and help keep the few protected pages there are, among them the precious Main Page, up to date.

Note that almost everything you can do can be undone, so don't be too worried about making mistakes. You will find more information at Wikipedia:Administrators, please take a look before experimenting with your new powers. Drop me a message if there are any questions or if you want to stop being a sysop (could it be?). Have fun! --Eloquence 00:53 20 Jun 2003 (UTC)

I'll try to help where and when I can. :-) --Menchi 04:19 20 Jun 2003 (UTC)

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The map of China

Did you color Taiwan on the China map green? Can you also copy the big star over Beijing and transfer it onto Taipei? Thanks. --Jiang 05:01 21 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Yep, green for the trees of the Central Mountain Ranges. :-)

Sure, I'll make a star for Taipei too. Thanks for pointing that out. --Menchi 05:06 21 Jun 2003 (UTC)

I just realized that green will be misunderstood by many Chinese and Taiwanese as a support of the Pan-Green Coalition. That's probably why you asked. I'll re-colour it to rice colour, as opposed to skin colour of the PRC. --Menchi 05:21 21 Jun 2003 (UTC)

No, that's not why I asked. I didn't think of that. Yeah...ROC Government websites have been turning quite green lately... Jiang 05:47 21 Jun 2003 (UTC)

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Mohawk river name

Thank you for finding the Mohawk name for the Saint Lawrence River. I've always been curious. - Montréalais

Thought it'd be interesting to show that things have different names, each of which reflect on the philosophy and culture of the namer. --Menchi 22:37 21 Jun 2003 (UTC)

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WP T-shirt design

Thanks for the suggestion. I will make the Thai phrase a little larger (I had no idea it was too small - it just looks like squiggles to me! :) -- Wapcaplet 12:05 27 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Welcome. --Menchi 12:22 27 Jun 2003 (UTC)

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Hawaii photo cm

Hi Menchi,

Thanks for the comments on my Hawaii photos. Can you try the Kauai 2.jpg again? I didn't link it properly the first time, but it's working for me now. Unless you mean from the Kauai entry - I only added the first one because I didn't want to overload the page with images.

-Aion 05:52 29 Jun 2003 (UTC)

My reply on User talk:Aion.

Okay, I figured out the problem with my second upload (it was a Photoshop file - oops!). And to answer your questions, I'm not a professional photographer, they're just my vacation photos from one of those helicopter tours.

-Aion 08:04 29 Jun 2003 (UTC)

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Ant's ban sarcasm and the mistaken nationality

Menchi, you know that I was being sarcastic about Anthere, right? I have ZERO problem with her English language skills. I was mocking RK's position. --Dante Alighieri 20:49 29 Jun 2003 (UTC)

No, I did not sense one bit of sarcasm at all, because your long history as a loyal Wikipedian who usually takes the side I consider right -- sometimes with real emotions (fine with me) -- makes me fail to see the sarcasm and irony that is apparently self-hatred, since yourself is similar in situation to Anther, i.e., a continental European by birth whose command of English is excellent and who loves Wikipedia. Your successful attempt at humour just sifted thru me easily like oversized rock pieces could. --Menchi 21:07 29 Jun 2003 (UTC)

I just realized that I've confused you with Andre Engels, oddly, when I was in the washroom. Apparently, urination is the source of enlightenments due to the relief of pain.

Just replace "continental European" with "congenital human", and reverse the polarity of everything and add 0.444 times pi to it, then you got yourself a completely accurate assessment. --Menchi 22:54 29 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Hehe, Dante.. Andre.. they sound somewhat the same, I suppose. :) In any event, I've often found that I realize the perfect edit that I need to make on the Wikipedia IMMEDIATELY after I turn off my computer for the evening. Not quite l'esprit d'escalier, but I don't know the french phrase for "turned-off-your-computer-already-and-don't-want-to-turn-it-back-on-again wit". All that aside, I'm not exactly what you would call a continental European, what with my being Californian, but you already realized that. I still like to think I'm a loyal Wikipedian who usually takes the side of right, but who knows, I'm sure that there are many who would disagree (our good friend ChuckM for example). ;) --Dante Alighieri 03:31 30 Jun 2003 (UTC)

I would think that you are a Wikipedian who deserves to be called as such. You were the person who noticed half a dozen Romanization redirects I made on the same title, as minor new edits. Many people hide minor edits. it shows a degree of care that you have for WP. --Menchi 05:23 30 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Incidentally, I just noticed you're a Star Trek fan. Take a look at Starship Enterprise and let me know what you think... I'd like to see more info on the different captains (as per my comments on the talk page). Got any stardates for us to use on the captain timeline? --Dante Alighieri 03:33 30 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Replied briefly in Talk:Starship Enterprise. --Menchi 05:23 30 Jun 2003 (UTC)

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Move page: not direct cut-&-paste

I see you have reverted my edits...How is a page supposed to be moved? --Jiang 00:41 30 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Replied on User talk:Jiang at 00:42 30 Jun 2003 (UTC)

It was actually written before Jiang asked, hence the only 1-minute difference. --Menchi 05:23 30 Jun 2003 (UTC)

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Banning Ant

Thanks a lot for your kind words Menchi. You moved me again :-) Ant

Merely speaking the truth that needs to be said. --Menchi 18:23 30 Jun 2003 (UTC)

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Naming of the Hui

Personally I perfer Hui Chinese over Hui, but it isn't a major preference. There isn't any large political issue that I can see here. -- Roadrunner

--Go ahead with the change kt2 00:24 8 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Lengthy subheading

I made some adjustments at Abolition. Thanks for pointing that out, I must have been going too fast that time. - Hephaestos 07:57 2 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Welcome. We've all been going too fast sometimes. I do, often, as evident from my very strange sentences (fixed) on that Talk page. --Menchi 08:00 2 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Synod title punctuation

I fixed Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod. Thanks! Emperorbma 23:26 3 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Welcome. --Menchi 23:40 3 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Slurs

I noticed your work on jook-sing. Do you think it appropriate for inclusion on List of ethnic slurs? Also, are there any other terms that we are missing? My knowledge of Asian pejoratives is not as expansive as it might be. --Dante Alighieri 09:12 6 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Actually, Jiang recently touched it. I haven't yet, although I am about to add stuff to it (typed it up already in FrontPage and am copyediting it), in like half an hour. But that's beside the point. Oh .. wait, I think you're talking about my redirect. Ok, anyway, yes, Jook-sing is an unpleasant slur, but it's of an ethnicity toward members of itself. It's like being a French, and call your French neighbour "Jean-o-lalalala". But it's an ethnic slur nonetheless in my thinking.

Mmm... more? Chinese used to (during late-Qing Dynasty) call the foreigners "Ghosts" (鬼子 Guizi), especially the Japanese (Riben Guizi), and white people are "Ghosts from the Seas" (洋鬼子 Yang Guizi). It's because of their clothing and appearances seem like from beyond the world of living. Those are not used at all now, unless you happen to be trapped in some kinda time loop.

--Menchi 09:36 6 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Romanization

Hi Menchi, just a quick request for help. Chow Chow has Chinese characters without transliteration, is there any chance you could fix it? Many thanks and never mind if you don't have time. Regards -- sannse 09:46 6 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Sure thing. --Menchi 09:49 6 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Re: Defunct provinces and Guoyu Cidian

Thanx for your help on Chinese provinces. :) Kt2

Any time. --Menchi 05:12 8 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Re: Image copyrighted

Hello I checked except the picture seems to have been deleted from the internet database that i got it from. I guess you could delete the file for the time being and I'll find other pictures later on.

Thanks. -Colipon 20:18 12 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Replied on User talk:Colipon. --Menchi 20:24 12 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Pipe linking to avoid redirect

An objection to [[A|B]] -> [[B]] at Asteroid

Dont change links so that they link to redirect pages, instead of actual articles. Pizza Puzzle

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Reply on naming convention informing

Great thanks alot - Colipon 21:31 12 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Article request

If you don't mind please start an article on Deng Xiaoping, the Chinese version. Thanks, Colipon 21:39 12 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Try posting your request on zh:Wikipedia:请求文章. --Menchi 21:45 12 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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External link placement

Hi Menchi - thanks for the comments on Gray Whale Ranch. I actually had the links as notes in the particular sections they referred to, but someone moved them all to the bottom. I was going to rename them, but I don't think they're all necessarily appropriate listed at the bottom (they are mostly just to confirm what I wrote, there isn't much additional info). Should I move some of them back to be notes on the sections? I will rename the ones that have additional information. - Aion 02:09 14 Jul 2003 (UTC)

The method most Wikipedians do is to place virtually all external links in the == External link == section, be it general or specific. But not all Wikipedians agree with placing specific reference to the bottom collective section. However, one thing is clear and undisputed, general or at least semi-general ext-link go to the bottom section, where one should at least name the website or page (perhaps as simply as "Official site"). In addition, some suggest writers to Wikipedia:Describe external links.

If the page has no additional info, you can place it in the == Reference == section if the info is really obscure. Otherwise, no reference is needed on the article page. Although, you are very welcome to place it in the Talk page. Others may find it interesting.

--Menchi 02:42 14 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Palo Duro Canyon cm

Hey, thanks for the kind words about Palo Duro Canyon. Looking over your talk page, it seems like you're a big booster -- I definitely appreciate it. Back into the fray! -- ESP 03:51 15 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Those I complimented deserve to hear that the quality of their works is recognized. When encountering what I consider to be good works, I try to take a minute to tell them that WP community appreciate their presence, especially those by newbies and photos Wikipedians personally took. If I see them persistently make good work or really gung ho, I nominate them for admin/sysop, if they aren't already. You're good and you should know that. --Menchi 04:14 15 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Thanks! I was happy to see that Second Barbary War was listed as one of the featured new articles today (although I think First Barbary War is more interesting). Brag brag brag. -- ESP 05:43 16 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Keep up the good work. :-) --Menchi 14:53 16 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Move, and redir del

Deletions are not necessary if the destination is simply a redirect with no other history. Is leaving the comment "Page moved from Political divisions of Taiwan" sufficient? --Jiang

Yeah, that note is good. But actually, redirects do require deletions as well, because they are physically Wiki-pages like any other. But you don't have to record the hist for cases like this, where the deleted redirect has just a one-version hist -- which is indicated pretty clear in the Talk we had there. In any case, you don't have to record anything in the Talk about redir del / move. I don't see many admins doing it, but it's documentation. --Menchi 14:53 16 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Chinese River Dolphin POV

I put "only" into the phrase "lived a year" because otherwise it might imply that the dolphin went on living somewhere else after that year at the given location. I didn't mean to use only to imply that it should have lived longer, but only lived a year. Stupid English and it's multiple meanings! Can you come up with a good way to express that the animal died after a year without implying any lack of care on the part of the institution? --Dante Alighieri 00:23 17 Jul 2003 (UTC)

P.S. Check my comments on Talk:Renminbi.

You added "only"?! Because I thought I did, as I was translating from several Chinese pages, which are frequently over-emotional and used words like "Alas!", "tragedy", "passing away sadly" and POV stuff like that, so I thought I unconsciously carried it over (because I find it a real tragedy as well). It wasn't a blatant POV that word, I only said that because I thought I did it. And I am not very lenient on myself, and apparently not a very good memory either!

So I clarified that point (a good point you raised) by just plainly say "died"!

--Menchi 00:43 17 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Nice work, it's perfectly clear now. BTW, I double checked and it was me who added "only". :) On another note, I found that "Giant Panda" of the rivers. Check Talk:Chinese River Dolphin. --Dante Alighieri 00:57 17 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Scientific name

Sorry about the posting on your user page - that was a little goof on my part. But now my comp isn't letting me cut and paste it onto here - could you go back into the history and do that? -Smack

Here:

Could you drop by talk:Scientific classification? -Smack 01:35 17 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Replied. --Menchi 01:56 17 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Multilingual on-line machine translation

Hi. E-mail me from http://www.faganfinder.com/site/contact.shtml so I can have your e-mail address. You seem like the sort of person who I should let preview something I'm working on :-) -Fagan

What Wikipedian username do you go by? And what have you done? There's no User:Fagan. --Menchi 18:06 25 Jul 2003 (UTC)

I think I've got User:mfagan, but the few edits I've done I've neglected to login for them. Do I have be be a wikipediholic before you'll talk to me? ;-)

I thought you may be somebody I knew from here. I guess not. What is this "something [you're] working on". I'm not into guessing game unless I'm stuck on a tropical island. --Menchi 18:21 25 Jul 2003 (UTC)

It's a tool that connects to online translators. I found you on the edits page of wiktionary's translation sources page.

Those are just random sites I came across (and apparently the Arabic translator-dictionary died the day after I added!) when I was translating some entries (just a dozen, actually).

And my infatuation with Wiktionary actually just died after those tiny edits. Not to re-flame again for at least another year. :-}

--Menchi 18:31 25 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Well if you don't want to see it, I'm not forcing you. I thought you might *want* to. And that site didn't die, it just goes offline sometimes

The translator connector idea sounds great. But I'm afraid all my mailboxes have a small limit, so you can't send the program to me. But if you give me a URL, it'd be easier for me to check it out later. --Menchi 18:40 25 Jul 2003 (UTC)

it's online, I only need to send you the URL. but I'll just list in here anyway www.faganfinder.com/translate/ . Missing some of the features it will have, a lot of translation sources, documentation, etc., etc.

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Sanya Image

Hi, I'm the person who posted re the Sanya image (Wiki booted me out of my log-in). Looking at the iamge history, it seems someone has removed it. I'll re-up load it again tonight. - David Stewart 03:09, 29 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Take your time. Someone, or at least the spirit, will always be lingering around the Pump. --Menchi 03:15, 29 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Cheers, I will. - David Stewart 03:22, 29 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Votes on Daniel C. Boyer

I just wanted to inform you that there is an actual vote going on at VfD regarding Daniel C. Boyer. MB 19:22, Jul 30, 2003 (UTC)

Alright. Voted. --Menchi 04:11, Jul 31, 2003 (UTC)

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1911 EB ref mv to Talk

Why are you moving 1911 ref to talk? olivier 04:44, 31 Jul 2003 (UTC)

I think it's Wikified and Wikipedized reasonably enough. I usually see that 1911 ref only on barely Wikified text with scanner-typos and all. You can move it back if you find it still still worthy of noting reader that. --Menchi 04:47, Jul 31, 2003 (UTC)

OK I see. I was just wondering whether there was a new trend to move all the 1911 refs to talk. I guess the article is decently de-1911-zed now. Thanks. olivier 05:01, 31 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Nisei versus Nitei

I'm afraid that I have little to contribute on this topic, as I don't speak Japanese. As far as I know, the children of Japanese immigrants have been called Nisei dating back at least to the early 20th century, if not back to Hawaii circa 1890. We can post the topic on the talk page if you're still interested, but I'm not the one to enlighten. Sorry. --ishu 21:38, 31 Jul 2003 (UTC)

It's alright. The the topic has already been on the talk page: Talk:Nisei Japanese. --Menchi 21:42, Jul 31, 2003 (UTC)

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Re: Test tube illustration

Hi, thanks for the compliment on my test tube drawing. Have you seen this tutorial? Wikipedia:How to draw a diagram with Microsoft Word {I am always trying to recruit more amature illustrators} Theresa knott 22:52, 31 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Yep, seen it. I draw faster with digital graphic program, like Corel Paint Shop Pro, though. But you and your recruits are doing a great job with MS Word! --Menchi 23:02, Jul 31, 2003 (UTC)

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Pemmican Proclamation

The Pemmican Proclamation was intended to hurt the trade of the North West Company. There's more information about it at Red River Colony. Trontonian

Thanks. --Menchi 01:37, Aug 1, 2003 (UTC)

You're welcome, but I was wrong. The proclamation was intended to conserve food, but the relationships between the Bay and the North West Company were so poor it led to violence. Sorry about the confusion. I fixed the article. Trontonian

Don't worry about it. Wiki tolerates non-malignant mistakes. --Menchi 01:41, Aug 1, 2003 (UTC)

And it's easy to get confused. Teaching Metis history has never been a Canadian priority. I saw an NFB cartoon short about the Red River Colony recently which portrayed them as unshaven thugs. La Voix des Mechif on APTN was an eye-opener to me. Trontonian

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Image display

Dear Menchi, I see you did some minor work on my new listing for Guilhermina Suggia. Do you know why my image isn't being uploaded from the image list? Maybe you can help. I've only been on wiki for two days. Thanks, Paul

Replied on User talk:Pauldarby. --Menchi 01:24, Aug 4, 2003 (UTC)

Thanks for the help - Paul

Welcome. --Menchi 01:31, Aug 4, 2003 (UTC)

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The Attars of Iran

Menchi, Attar of Neishapour is different from Attar of Shiraz (whom many don't even know of), Shiraz and Neishapour are indeed seperate cities! However there is so little known of Attar of Shiraz that one may only say Hafez was his disciple! Thanks for the note!

Regards,

Alireza Hashemi

Anytime. --Menchi 01:05, Aug 6, 2003 (UTC)

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Mintguy's adminship

Thank you for your support regarding my admin status. It is sincerely appreciated. Mintguy 22:18, 5 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Simply stated the truth. --Menchi 01:05, Aug 6, 2003 (UTC)

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The Magic School Bus

Thanks :-), but I only combined the books and tv shows... er but thanks anyway :-p Evil saltine 13:34, 8 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Combining this, merging that! Those require patience, which is a virtue here. :-) --Menchi 20:03, Aug 8, 2003 (UTC)

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Chinese provinces

Oh, I'm just doing that mainly out of convenience. I'm changing [[China]] to [[People's Republic of China]] (except for Fujian and defunt provinces)because that's what the current administration is under. It's inconsistent w/ our naming conventions to say that Beijing is one of four centrally administered municiplaities in China. It is one of four in the PRC, not all China. --Jiang 22:58, 9 Aug 2003 (UTC)

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Image:Parliament3.jpg

Re Wikipedia:Brilliant pictures - thanks very much!! :D - Montréalais 05:48, 11 Aug 2003 (UTC)

That Ottawa River photo is no doubt the most poetic "painting" with an artistic composition in that list so far planned by the photographer himself (You can't count those Da Vinci photos there, the photographers didn't plan out the width, positions, distance, ... themselves). Very artistic is what it is. --Menchi 06:03, Aug 11, 2003 (UTC)

Kanji in Tomita

I'm terribly sorry about the Kanji in Isao Tomita. The thing is I don't have any foreign alphabet installed and it looks like (???) from my PC. As I know nothing about Kanji, I suggest you put the original characters there. Thanks for the advice. David 19:45, 11 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Don't worry about mistakes. It's easily to fix, at least this case :-p --Menchi 19:58, Aug 11, 2003 (UTC)

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Retouched nostalgic Pump image

Thanks, I try :). ミハエル (MB) 03:32, Aug 12, 2003 (UTC)

Welcome. --Menchi 03:34, Aug 12, 2003 (UTC)

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Confederation

Hey, great minds think alike :) I think the confusion was partially because it said "latter," maybe that was a spelling mistake and it should have read "later" all along. I have heard the post-1867 people referred to as "fathers" as well, Smallwood for example being the "last Father of Confederation" (so far). "Founders" is an alternate term for the original Fathers, but I don't think I've ever heard it applied specifially to the post-Confederation fathers like Smallwood. The National Library's website considers them all Fathers, apparently ([1]). Adam Bishop 05:35, 12 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Ah, actually, now that I look at that site more carefully, the "fathers" are indicated separately. So I don't really know what to call the others... Adam Bishop 05:52, 12 Aug 2003 (UTC)

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Hi, you cast a vote in the TEMP5 debate. The Temp5 proposal was voted down by 61.3% to 38.6%. We seem to be going around in circlces on the whole issue of the main page. A new vote is now taking place to clarify what exactly we want, namely

1. Do we actually want to have a new page?
2. If so when (immediately, after a pause, timed to the press release, etc)?
3. What do people want on the front page and what do they want excluded?

As of now, the whole issue seems surrounded by complete confusion. This way, finally and definitively, we will know what we want and when we want it. So do please express your opinions. The vote is on the same page as the previous votes. FearÉIREANN 20:27, 13 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Voted and comment at Talk:Main Page/Layout design. This annotated voting system is more fun than drop-ballot type! :-) --Menchi 20:40, Aug 13, 2003 (UTC)

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Deletion request explanation

Hey, how come you tossed my request to delete the Giovanni di Bicci de’ Medici redirect page? I though I had a pretty good argument. You may not agree with it, but I wish you'd say so, and explained why, instead of deleting the request without any notice. Noel 06:45, 17 Aug 2003 (UTC)

The Giovanni di Bicci de’ Medici entry I removed links to a non-existent or deleted "de’ Medici", not "de’ Medici" you mentioned above. I don't know if you ever listed Giovanni di Bicci de’ Medici "de’ Medici" on the VfD.

And I explained why I removed it in the summary "Del(eted)".

--Menchi 07:00, Aug 17, 2003 (UTC)

I don't know what you deleted, but the page I listed (here's my VfD entry again [2]) links to a real page, a Redirect page that is still there. Noel 07:50, 17 Aug 2003 (UTC)

That may not be what you listed, but a non-existent/deleted page is what it's become: [3]. --Menchi 08:15, Aug 17, 2003 (UTC)

Someone else must have edited the VfD page with some software that mangled the funny character. (I'm too tired to look at the log and figure out who it was.) I guess I should put my original listing back? Noel 09:42, 17 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Sure. Maybe you should use URL link [4] that cannot possible be altered accidentially or not. --Menchi 09:44, Aug 17, 2003 (UTC)

Hmm, good idea, but I'm not sure it will work, since people are editing the page source, not the displayed text. Still, worth a try. Thanks! Noel 09:58, 17 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Duhhh, I get it now - the way you did it, the funny character is encoded, not quoted literally. Yes, that should be impervious. (Sorry, been up way too long....) Noel 12:47, 17 Aug 2003 (UTC)

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What's the Chinese translation of "Commonwealth of the Philippines"? --Samuel 08:09, 19 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Will answer on User talk:Menchi. WP is nagging about size ("WARNING: ..30 kb"); archiving. --Menchi 17:31, Aug 19, 2003 (UTC)