Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mahir Cagri
This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record.
The result of the debate was keep. —Korath (Talk) 15:46, Mar 17, 2005 (UTC)
Mahir Cagri[edit]
How is this subject even remotely encyclopedic? GRider\talk 23:27, 3 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Delete, promotion, possible vanity. Megan1967 23:47, 3 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Delete was a minor meme in the olden days. I'd say the 15 minutes are about up, and it wasn't exactly all your base even at its height. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 00:48, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)
- OK, I never heard of this guy until now, and I have no idea of just how much of an internet phenomenon he was, but there is clearly a precedent for the inclusion of major internet phenomonena in wikipedia. Reading this page and looking at the photo it struck me that this guy really reminds me of Borat. Is there any evidence that he was the inspiration for that character? If so then maybe merge and redirect there? No vote as of now, but I'm curious about this. Anyone have any information on this? Am I off my rocker? -R. fiend 04:19, 4 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- I suppose only Borat's creators know for sure, but my guess is no. Their countries of origin are different, for a start, and Borat's most prevelant characteristic (anti-semitism) isn't something associated with Mahir. They do have some similar physical characteristics, but I think Borat is more of a reference to a stereotyped foreign guy (like a less-cute Andy Kauffman's "foreign man") than a reference to any specific person. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 14:33, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)
- I wouldn't call anti-semitism Borat's most prevelant characteristic, at least not in the beginning. I think it sort of grew as Cohen realized how useful it was in what he was doing. Anyway, it wasn't just his appearance that got we wondering, but the "I like sex" thing as well. Their countries are different, but I know Cohen chose Kazakstan because he was pretty sure he wouldn't have to worry about running into someone who was particularly familiar with that country. A google search leads me to believe that I'm not the first to make the connection, but there is no evidence that Borat was directly inspired by Cagri, so maybe merge a few sentences into the Internet phenomena article and redirect. He's already mentioned there. That would mean losing the great photo, but we can live with that. -R. fiend 15:53, 4 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- I suppose only Borat's creators know for sure, but my guess is no. Their countries of origin are different, for a start, and Borat's most prevelant characteristic (anti-semitism) isn't something associated with Mahir. They do have some similar physical characteristics, but I think Borat is more of a reference to a stereotyped foreign guy (like a less-cute Andy Kauffman's "foreign man") than a reference to any specific person. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 14:33, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)
- Major internet phenomena do get included in Wikipedia. This one, however, gets 837 googles, which does not even remotely qualify as such. Delete. Radiant! 09:45, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)
- Keep. This is a major Internet phenomenon. This guy spawned the "I KISS YOU!!!" thing; Googling that yields over 100,000 hits. Don't delete Mahir, who wants come to Turkey, he can invitate! Android79 13:57, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)
- Come on, now... do you really think every time the 3 common words "i kiss you" appear next to each other on Google, it's a reference to Mahir? I think not. If I run the same exact-phrase search, more than half of the result on the first two pages are obsviously not Mahir references, many are merely part of "can I kiss you" or "may I kiss you", etc. If I add "mahir" to the search query, the number of results drops more than 90%. Besides, even if he coined a minor internet catchprase, does that necessarily make him encyclopedia-worthy? "Have A Nice Day" is a far bigger catchprase, and I doubt that whoever made it up has an entry (and rightly so). Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 14:42, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)
- Well, no, but the name of whoever created "Have A Nice Day" was not linked to the catchphrase itself, whereas the name of "Mahir" spread along with "I KISS YOU!!!" If we had a List of Internet memes, I'd say it could be merged there. -- Antaeus Feldspar 15:44, 4 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- I think that's a really good idea. Internet memes are a bit like local politicians and others who tap-dance around the notability line: a fairly large number of people don't think they belong in an encylopedia, but enough people care about them that they can't be entirely ignored, either. A list would satisfy both groups. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 15:57, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)
- D'oh! Chalk that one up to lack of caffeine. I must have been thinking that "I kiss you" is ungrammatical/uncommon enough to only catch what I was looking for... anyway, where do you get a 90% dropoff? Google for "i kiss you" mahir returns 32,000 hits. I stand by my claim that this is a well-known enough meme to have its own article. If not, well, it's time to put up stuff like Badger Badger Badger for VfD as well. Android79 15:55, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)
- Hmm, now that's really strange. I get 10,900 for "i kiss you" mahir and even if I remove the quotes it only goes up to 13,800. It idn't Safe Search, either, because that's turned off. I dunno. I probably would support a VfD for Badger3, even though I personally find it amusing. Overall though I like Antaeus' list idea for topics like these. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 16:03, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)
- As his heydey was apparently 6 years ago, a google search now would not reflect how popular he was in his prime. The guy who popularized Mahir's page claimed he got 500,000 hits in two weeks, which is quite a lot. Also Mahir's page counter which has only been active since 2002 (still 3 years after his initial popularity) has a comparable number of hits, which is still a lot for a personal web page. I'm not a good judge of exactly when an internet phenomena is really widespread enough to warrant inclusion, so I'm still wavering on this one, but I think we do have to look to what other such things are included in wikipedia, and compare. -R. fiend 16:11, 4 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Hmm, now that's really strange. I get 10,900 for "i kiss you" mahir and even if I remove the quotes it only goes up to 13,800. It idn't Safe Search, either, because that's turned off. I dunno. I probably would support a VfD for Badger3, even though I personally find it amusing. Overall though I like Antaeus' list idea for topics like these. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 16:03, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)
- Well, no, but the name of whoever created "Have A Nice Day" was not linked to the catchphrase itself, whereas the name of "Mahir" spread along with "I KISS YOU!!!" If we had a List of Internet memes, I'd say it could be merged there. -- Antaeus Feldspar 15:44, 4 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Come on, now... do you really think every time the 3 common words "i kiss you" appear next to each other on Google, it's a reference to Mahir? I think not. If I run the same exact-phrase search, more than half of the result on the first two pages are obsviously not Mahir references, many are merely part of "can I kiss you" or "may I kiss you", etc. If I add "mahir" to the search query, the number of results drops more than 90%. Besides, even if he coined a minor internet catchprase, does that necessarily make him encyclopedia-worthy? "Have A Nice Day" is a far bigger catchprase, and I doubt that whoever made it up has an entry (and rightly so). Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 14:42, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)
- Major internet phenomena. So what if it was a few years ago? It's still notable. Keep. Bubb Rubb may not be math theorems or plant categorizations, but it's still notable as an internet meme. Mike H 17:52, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)
- Keep. Despite some people's assumptions, this was a major Internet phenomenon. The guy made Wired! Radiant I don't know what you searched for, but '"i kiss you" mahir' returns about 10,000 Google hits. Rhobite 17:57, Mar 4, 2005 (UTC)
- Is this a joke? Extremely strong keep. Famous internet meme with significant media coverage. Gamaliel 18:02, 4 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Keep. Was famous, got piles of verifiable coverage - David Gerard 01:48, 5 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- I KISS YOU!!! - Keep - as notable (if not more so) than any other silly internet meme. -- Cyrius|✎ 05:38, 5 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Keep. This guy is arguably one of the first internet celebrities. He was on various TV shows, news shows, and he was invited to talk at conferences (IIRC). Maybe not on par with AYBABTU, but definitely more notable than Bubb Rubb (woo woo!). CryptoDerk 05:41, Mar 5, 2005 (UTC)
- Keep for the time being. This was a fairly big Internet phenomenon at the time and is still remembered by many. If absolutely nobody remembers him in 10 years, then we can be sure he was just a fad and can delete the article. Psychonaut 03:52, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- KEEP DUDE IT's F'in MAHIR, MAHIR RULES!
- Keep - agreed with two comments ago: we'll revisit this in 5, 10 years and see whether it has stood the test of time. - DavidWBrooks 13:34, 7 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- This was nominated for deletion months ago and, I thought, deleted. I can find no record of the prior discussion, though. I think it pre-dated our archiving procedure. That said, I believe that this has already failed the test of time. Delete. Rossami (talk) 23:14, 7 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- This wasn't nominated for deletion before. There are only a handful of edits to the article and so it's rather quick to check all the diffs and verify this. CryptoDerk 23:42, Mar 7, 2005 (UTC)
- Comment: Human memory is of course fallible, but I am sure beyond any shadow of doubt that this topic has been previously nominated. (I am not as sure of the decision.) The fact that there is no evidence in the article history is, unfortunately, not proof that a nomination never took place. 1) I can not say for sure that this topic was previously created at this exact title. It might have been a slightly different transliteration of his name. 2) It was long enough that it might have been prior to one of the database failures that took out some history files. Regardless, I still can't find a copy of the prior discussion. Unless someone else can, it's probably moot. My own vote is not based on the prior discussion but on my assessment of the current relevance of his impact. Clearly I am in the minority on this one but no change of vote. Rossami (talk) 14:00, 8 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- This wasn't nominated for deletion before. There are only a handful of edits to the article and so it's rather quick to check all the diffs and verify this. CryptoDerk 23:42, Mar 7, 2005 (UTC)
- I KEEP YOU!!!. —RaD Man (talk) 07:33, 8 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Keep he can stay my wikipedia! ALKIVAR™
08:24, 8 Mar 2005 (UTC) - Keep or merge somewhere. Kappa 10:09, 8 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Keep -- he became an online household name there for a moment. Certainly notable. - Longhair | Talk 15:49, 8 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Keep, of course. —Xezbeth 15:55, Mar 8, 2005 (UTC)
- Keep. Urgh, the long years haven't softened the horrific memory of Mahir in his trunks. Shudder. -- John Fader (talk • contribs) 03:00, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- This must be a joke! Of course Keep!! Go Yahoo! netrospective and see 10 years, 100 moments of the Web. Mahir is on the third place of the list! Sulakalan 04:52, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Keep. This was one of the very first Internet phenomena, one of the first Internet celebrities. It showed for the first time how the Internet could very rapidly spread memes and spawn fads much faster than ever before, a new social phenomenon. In the future, historians will study the early history of the Internet... it's as important as the early history of television. Someday somebody will do a PhD thesis on the Mahir/I-Kiss-You meme, if it hasn't happened already. I'm dead serious. -- Curps 07:05, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Keep. Guinness book of World Records for the most-viewed homepage: [1] 'Nuff said. --TexasDex 04:45, Mar 11, 2005 (UTC)
This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion, or the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.