Talk:Beloved (novel)

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Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment[edit]

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 9 January 2019 and 8 May 2019. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Samanthadies.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 15:34, 16 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Not very detailed analysis[edit]

What is there on Beloved is simple not avery detailed, or in places good, analysis. Many key points needed to understand the work are missing, and some information is misleading - for example the sentence that Sethe does not bother with her ther children anymore is simply wrong, as only Denver is still in the house anyway. Otherwise, some characters as her two sons are negleted completly. Please someone, sort this out!

I will add an analysis that is more in depth with the support of prior authors and sources, to this article. I plan to find some critiques and analysis done by other author's to support my insight followed by referencing them so others can find this information. There will be some key points made as I plan to retread this work and write about it with support from other scholastic sources that have been peer reviewed, my analysis will be cited so others can go and read as well. Jnaeagbenla (talk) 00:52, 1 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Beloved's status[edit]

An anon editor just changed the part about Beloved being Sethe's daughter to "it remains vague whether" Beloved is Sethe's daughter. I reverted it; I thought it was quite clear who Beloved was, to Sethe, to Denver, to Paul, and to the folks who come and perform the exorcism. | Klaw ¡digame! It might be clear to them, but it is never said outright. Wikipedia is not about conjecture, but plausible theories can be presented (i think) as long as it is clear they are theories.

I agree, Beloved's status is very ambiguous throughout. Although there are suggestions she is Sethe's daughter, there are also vague references to the character being stolen by white men and placed on a cramped slave ship (which Sethe's dead child never experienced, having lived and died on American soil). --131.111.247.135 (talk) 19:05, 20 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I agree as well. I just read that "Denver immediately recognizes the young woman as the reincarnation of her dead sister" and "Sethe discovers that Beloved is indeed pregnant with Paul D's child"... both statements are blatantly false. They are alluded to or hinted at in the novel, but because Morrison never presents them as fact, we can't just assume them to be true. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.6.109.5 (talk) 21:37, 20 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I have made significant changes to the plot summary that attempt to show both possibilities without preference for either. L.cash.m (talk) 18:49, 12 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Nobel prize?[edit]

It mention's Beloved as a pulitzer prize winner - I was under the impression that Toni Morrisson had received a nobel prize in literature for Beloved. My edition certainly mentions the nobel prize on the cover.

Morrison won the Nobel Prize in Literature in 1993, six years after Beloved was published. The official Nobel website states that she was a recipient because she is one "who in novels characterized by visionary force and poetic import, gives life to an essential aspect of American reality;" [1] so Beloved is one of the many reasons she was honored, but not the only reason. The Nobel prize recognizes an author's full body of work, not just one piece of it. Maria 14:37, 11 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]
"Beloved" itself won the Pulitzer Prize for Fiction in 1988. http://www.pulitzer.org/ (click on 1988). Anrie 14:47, 13 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Sounds too much like a notes site[edit]

This page sounds too much like SparkNotes or some other similar source. Perhaps the section on themes should be removed and instead have a synopsis of the book, with references to notes sites rather than using this page as an analysis of major themes. This page also could use more citations. Just a thought 24.31.111.166 05:36, 10 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Additionally, there is a definitive lack of addressing the complexity of the narrative scope-- such as addressing the interweaving sequences of "real time" and flashbacks or memories. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.164.212.53 (talk) 19:19, 1 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I agree. I think the list of characters lends itself to read more as a notes source. Instead of spending the vast majority of the space on character description, it could be helpful to reduce that section and create a more thorough plot summary. Samanthadies (talk) 20:13, 28 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

pronunciation[edit]

Is the second e in Beloved in this case mute or not? --128.176.233.115 18:24, 11 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

> Sethe (pronounced "Seth-uh")

Would that be ['seθə]? --128.176.233.115 10:33, 20 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I believed the seconde "e" in "Beloved" is voiced, as it is from the phrase "Dearly Beloved" (from which Beloved got her name). I'm not sure about the pronunciation of "Sethe": it is mentioned in the book that it is a man's name, so it could very well be pronounced like the modern "Seth". Anrie 14:43, 13 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The mother of Sethe is shown calling her "Seth-uh"; however, it is possible Sethe's mother is a native african, and the resulting "uh" is just a result of an accent.

Toni Morrison also put out a book on CD featuring herself reading Beloved. According to that edition, the second "e" in "Sethe" is pronounced, as is the second "e" in "Beloved." --Jll294 01:12, 30 March 2010.

Plot summary[edit]

wow, that needs work! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 169.237.90.163 (talk) 16:17, 24 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

This plot summary implies several interpretations which aren't explicit in the novel at all - Beloved putting a spell on Paul D and Howard/Buglar running away because of a fear of their mother [not a fear of the ghost], for example. 17/05/09, Dan —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.234.4.1 (talk) 12:45, 17 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Significant edits done today that attempt to resolve issues. L.cash.m (talk) 18:49, 12 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, I think Instead of having one big chunk of text on this article under the "Plot" section, I plan to break it up and make the plot summary into this timeline of major events and how it relates to overarching themes. I think that the plot can be significantly strengthened by having some strong references and also taking into account all major events in the frame of this big time line that talks about major events as the novel begins and how it continues on this exposition through until the end. This is what I am going to work on then so that this page has relevant but supported references for other people that need information about the plot. Jnaeagbenla (talk) 00:34, 1 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Toni Morrison On World Book Club[edit]

A chance to ask questions to improve this article! On Monday 27th October 2008, Toni Morrison will be talking about Beloved on the BBC radio programme World Book Club. If you're in the UK, you can be part of the audience at a London venue to be confirmed (recording will start at 16.00 hours). If you cannot attend, but would still like to put a question to Toni Morrison about Beloved, email worldbookclub@bbc.co.uk (until 21th October)[2]. EdQuine (talk) 21:24, 18 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

mossy teeth?[edit]

Hey guys, I have to read Beloved for English class, and I was wondering what the significance of the "mossy teeth" is? Is it a disease of the boys who have it, or does it allude to something else? My English teacher thinks it's pretty important, but doesn't remember what it signifies off the top of her head. Thanks- Kanogul (talk) 03:37, 12 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I think it just means that they have poor dental hygiene (and I suppose you could draw more conclusions from that). I remember the term being used in The Catcher in the Rye to describe a boy's teeth looked. TakaraLioness (talk) 15:36, 3 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Pregnant Beloved[edit]

the plot summary also failed to mention that beloved was pregnant with Paul D's baby towards the end when sethe refused to eat,and when the townsfolk came to perform an exorcism —Preceding unsigned comment added by Deman531 (talk • contribs) 00:24, 15 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Where is this within the novel? There was no mention of Beloved's pregnancy either in the work nor in graduate level class discussions of the work that support that concept that I am aware of. If you can provide page numbers or significant quotes from the novel that provide proof, I'll add it. L.cash.m (talk) 18:49, 12 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

On page 308 of my edition (Vintage), when the women approach Sethe's house to confront Beloved: "The devil child was clever, they thought. And beautiful. It had taken the shape of a pregnant woman." Earlier on, her stomach is described as looking like a watermelon. 4 October 2014.

awful[edit]

This is a terrible plot summary. It needs a lot of work in all aspects. A B rated article needs more attention than this. Dirtbike spaceman (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 05:53, 2 March 2009 (UTC).[reply]

Just to start us off down the long road of recovery I went a head and corrected all the misspelled words.Dirtbike spaceman (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 05:57, 2 March 2009 (UTC).[reply]

Additional edits done today for clarity. L.cash.m (talk) 18:49, 12 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Beyond the Plot Summary[edit]

The major themes section is poorly done -- there is no notation for how "mother-daughter relationships" and "psychological impact of slavery" are listed as the major theme. Also, this page could benefit from a "critical response" section. L.cash.m (talk) 03:42, 3 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Very weak article[edit]

Beloved is a much more powerful novel than this article makes it out to be. It's a masterpiece of literature, and the themes go way beyond the two that are listed. You could write a freaking essay on the last two pages alone! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.47.245.66 (talk) 22:53, 30 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I plan to go back through Toni Morrison's novel Beloved and comb through to find major overarching themes that are very relevant for this piece. I agree this article is so weak for such a significant piece of literature therefore I am doing a project to help enhance the details that have been added to this article. This article can be really improved by instead of having one big chunk of text on this article under the "Plot" section, I plan to break it up and make the plot summary into this timeline of major events and how it relates to overarching themes. I am also adding a section about the characters that relates to the themes and how they show the themes through major events within the novel. Jnaeagbenla (talk) 00:47, 1 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Recent revert of large-scale changes[edit]

I reverted the mass edits back because they are WP:Original research (specifically WP:SYN) and thus violate a neutral point of view, even though they include citations. It should also be noted that the additions were not all properly placed. This is why I used "revert" to reinstate the previous version of the page. Icarus of old (talk) 04:22, 10 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

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Newer Sources[edit]

I noticed that a lot of the sources used to discuss the novel's major themes as well as sources for the analysis of the novel in the Legacy section were originally published in the 1990s or earlier. I believe the article would benefit from the inclusion of information from more contemporary scholarly journals/articles about the book as well as from more information regarding the situations in which the book has been banned or challenged in public schools and libraries. More information about the counterarguments raised whenever the book is banned would be particularly helpful. There are also some parts of the Major Themes section that seem to lack sources and I am unsure whether certain paragraphs of that section constitute original research, but I think the section should be better cited regardless. SebastianG1002 (talk) 03:28, 17 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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